Martial Edge talks exclusively to Bruce Thomas, one of the world’s leading biographers of Bruce Lee and the author of popular titles Fighting Spirit and Fighting Words. His brand new book, Immortal Combat – Portrait of a True Warrior, is a detailed study on the theories of martial arts, martial science and martial sport, and the conflicting principles between the three philosophies.
Martial Edge: Why did you decide to write Immortal Combat?
Bruce Thomas: I was prompted to write this book after reading the book, The Intelligent Warrior, by my good friend and martial arts brother Steve Jones who first used the terms ‘martial art’, ‘martial sport’ and ‘martial science’ in a very specific way. I wanted to express my own appreciation of what these mean, because they are very relevant at this time.
Martial Edge: Who is the book aimed at?
The book’s aim is to remind those who may not know, or who might have forgotten, of the great potential of martial art practice as a Way, which far outstrips its current appeal as a combative sport. The path of the true martial artist is one of self knowledge and self mastery, while the lesser ambition of the so-called ‘ultimate fighter’ or ‘cage warrior’ is to set him- of herself above or apart from others.
Martial Edge: Bruce Lee, Joe Lewis, Morihei Ueshiba - Why did you choose to focus your book on these three particular martial artists?
Bruce Thomas: The principal aim of the book is to address the divergence between martial art and martial sport, and to show that this has also been paralleled by the divergence in the roles of the soldier and the warrior in society. Joe Lewis is most definitely a martial sportsman, fiercely proud of his tournament achievements and who was also a Marine in Vietnam. Morihei Ueshiba is most definitely a martial artist, who used his art as a path to self-mastery and reconnection with life at large. He opted out of fighting as a soldier because he saw the ultimate futility of it and initiated a martial art whose principal aim is to resolve conflict. Bruce Lee, I feel, was pulled at one moment to perfect his art to the highest level and at the next by his ambitions to be recognized and to be a star. The interplay of the forces of ambition and integrity, ego and spirit, or art for art’s sake and using an art for the sake of prizes, are presented by comparing and contrasting the lives of these three.
Joe Lewis is the epitome of a martial sportsman; o sensei is the essence of the martial artist. One of Bruce Lee’s great contributions was in bringing the martial arts to the attention of the western world and to into the modern era and making them generally known. But his great genius was as a martial scientist.
What do we mean by the expression ‘martial scientist’? From the perspective of martial science, everyone is subject to the same laws: for example, the law of gravity, and the fact that none of us has more than two arms and two legs. It stands to reason that if our understanding of these natural laws is superior to anyone else’s then we have a definite advantage. Martial science is the study of the mechanisms—human anatomy, physics, body mechanics, fighting techniques and strategies, etc—that allow this. Bruce Lee could see any technique from any martial art once, be it Judo, escrima or Tae Kwon Do, and execute it or improve upon it as if he had mastered it for years. I believe that it was his grounding in the core principles (what he called ‘the roots of combat’) which he found in wing chun and in particular in the awareness developed by chi sao (sticking hands) practice that enhanced his natural ability to do this.
Martial Edge: As a writer and martial artist, what is it about Bruce Lee that continues to inspire you?
Bruce Thomas: The answer is partly in the question. Bruce Lee’s philosophy allows for us all to follow our own path and aspire to be the best example of who we are, and most certainly not to imitate or worship him. A good carpenter on a film set would have his respect far more than a hack film director, regardless of his place in the accepted pecking order. I don’t know what Bruce Lee would have thought of me as a martial artist, but I would hope to earn his respect as a writer.
I am frequently amused by the characters that populate Bruce Lee fandom—like those who don’t see the irony of belonging to a fan club whose motto says ‘towards personal liberation’. In that regard they are a bit like the members of The Prisoner Appreciation Society, who are fans of the 1960s cult TV program about the efforts of Patrick McGoohan to escape from the village where he is being held against his will, and where he is referred to only as No.6. His protest is ‘I am not a number, I am a free man!’ Every year a group of numbties all wearing No. 6 badges herd together to celebrate this show, in direct contradiction to the whole point of it. Groucho Marx had it right when he said he wouldn’t want to belong to any club that would have him as a member.
I mean, would you expect the spirit of Bruce Lee to be hanging around at Bruce Lee conventions? Bruce Lee asks us to seek out the essence of what inspired him, to make the best of ourselves. Bottom line: he stops me getting too lazy!
Martial Edge: Do you think that every martial artist since Bruce Lee will inevitably be compared to Bruce Lee, despite their achievements?
Bruce Thomas: Yes. For me, the most inspiring physical performer currently at large is Cristiano Ronaldo. The inevitable comparisons are made with Pele, Maradona, Cruyf and Best. As a screen martial artist Tony Jaa is very watchable. As a martial artist, the nearest we have to Bruce Lee is the renegade Shaolin monk Shi Yan Ming who defected from their US tour and is now teaching and working to establish a Shaolin temple in New York.
Martial Edge: Joe Lewis is quoted as saying that wing chun and the traditional systems are too ‘old fashioned’ – what are your views on this?
Bruce Thomas: I think this view of the importance of cutting edge technology has come a little unstuck of late. America has the mightiest and most technologically sophisticated arsenal in the world; but it proved to be no match for terrorists armed with box cutters who captured civil planes and flew them straight into America’s centres of commerce and defence. Neither has it proved much use in bringing to heel a bearded and turbaned man ‘armed’ with not much more than a mobile phone and a camel. The old fashioned approach seems to be proving remarkably resilient.
Wing chun is highly relevant because it still relates to the roots of combat, it embraces and teaches core principles based on the natural laws mentioned above. Its chief weapon is the cultivation of the ‘contact reflex’ which eventually brings an automatic response to whatever kind of attack one is presented with. To say that wing chun is old fashioned is like saying that breathing has been around a while, or gravity is past its sell by date. If progress was measured only by developments in technology or upgrading weapons, then evolution would be achieved simply by providing cannibals with knives and forks. It isn’t about accumulating more weapons or developing new ones, it’s about core principles. But ultimately wouldn’t the best martial artist be the intuitive who knew where trouble might take place and so avoid it or pre-empt it?
Martial Edge: If Lee was around today, would his principal philosophy behind Jeet Kune Do have changed?
Bruce Thomas: At its deepest expression JKD reflects the very nature of the Tao itself, and so there is as little or as much understanding in it as there is in the person who is looking. From the point of view of Bruce Lee’s personal emphasis, we can only speculate. Personally I would very much doubt that at the age of 67 he would still be doing spinning heel kicks for a living. He may well have embraced the ecological aspects of Taoism and JKD and be working actively in that field. Like Ali, his achievement outside of the ring might have been his greatest. As a man who has done more than most to promote the image of the Chinese in the modern world, if he were still alive I could see him being chosen to light the Olympic flame for the Beijing Games. Or, he may have worked more on the mental side of his art than the physical.
Martial Edge: To achieve excellence in the martial arts is it more important to strengthen your mind, or strengthen your body?
Bruce Thomas: My answer to this question is to ask to what extent the mind can be separated from the body. On an immediate level, I have just returned from a four hour bike ride, and as a result my perceptions are clearer and my mind is sharper. Bodhidharma saw that the scholarly monks of Shaolin were in bad physical shape and devised what was, in essence, the prototype version of qi gong because, as he told them, the body and mind are inseparable. One hand washes the other. Ultimately the body, mind and spirit are not inseparable.
Obviously you can’t be a martial artist if you are unfit; nor if your mind is ‘flabby’. But once again it is important to separate the martial sportsman from the martial artist. Both Mike Tyson and Ali were formidable boxers; but it is pretty evident that there is a vast gulf in their inner motivations. Mike Tyson went to jail for raping a vulnerable young woman. Ali went to jail for refusing to fight a war he did not believe in. If you like, his stand as a pacifist made him into a ‘passive fist’.
For the rest of us, studying or practising a martial art holds up a mirror to the self in which the physical reflects the mental and vice versa. For example, in learning how to find a way into fighting range we often discover that there isn’t simply a physical problem to be solved but that we also have to cross mental and emotional divides.
But as a final consideration, ask yourself if you wouldn’t mind having the skills of a Derren Brown, who can manipulate minds and emotions in a specific way. Would you trade in your black belt for that? Would you rather be able see a fight through, or simply be able mentally to order the opponent to stop it?
Martial Edge: In discussing ‘the greatest’, is it important to discount fact from fantasy? If so, how can finding ‘the greatest’ be measured?
Bruce Thomas: Things like this can’t be measured. All I would add is that it’s pretty hard to understand these days (when it would appear to any Martian recently landed that celebrity is the highest that anyone on this planet can aspire to) that there are people who actively seek to keep their abilities quiet. I know those who have met, for example, the owner of a Chinese supermarket in Lancashire who can immobilise people simply by looking at them; and an 83-year old former monk in San Francisco who can kick you on the head faster than you could clap your hands. Fact or fantasy? Actually, it’s fact. The greatest martial artist in the world might be the guy who cleans your windows.
Martial Edge: In a rapidly modernising world of guns and nuclear warfare, what does the future hold for the martial artist? Is there still a place for the martial warrior in today’s society?
Bruce Thomas: 'Any fool can pull a trigger’, which is why Enter the Dragon contrives a story line for the action to take place on an island where guns are banned. But I believe that at the ultimate level nuclear weaponry is already obsolete. Microwave weaponry with the ability to influence human behaviour seems to be the way things are going. The biggest ‘advances’ in combat might well be those taking place in areas of ‘psychic combat’ or the manipulation of human energies. As Jung said, a man thinking the right thoughts miles away from anyone can have more impact on the world than endless campaigning and agitation. In this regard the mental aspect of combat, or of restoring harmony, is one important aspect of the future of martial art.
This means that we have a choice, and the knowledge that what we focus our energies on affects everything and everyone. What do we choose to attack, or what do we choose to defend? Learning a martial art as a means of self understanding is still one of the finest ways of life that anyone can undertake. But where does this ‘self’ end? At my skin, my family, my job, my race, my country, my martial art, my achievements, the planet…?
As a man who has done more than most to promote the image of the Chinese in the modern world, if he (Bruce Lee) were still alive I could see him being chosen to light the Olympic flame for the Beijing Games. Or, he may have worked more on the mental side of his art than the physical.
Interviews 
Martial Edge talks exclusively to Bruce Thomas, one of the world’s leading biographers of 
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Martial Edge: To achieve excellence in the martial arts is it more important to strengthen your mind, or strengthen your body? 
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